Interview: Richard M. (Dick) Johnson
By Stan Ciurczak
Editor’s Note: Richard (Dick) Johnson recently retired from the FAA after 42 years of service. In addition to his many years of service as a civilian employee, Rich also spent many years in the U.S. Army and the U.S. Navy. Dick also has given his all to the Showmakers, a local theatre troupe, for many years. He will continue with Showmakers, begin a new part-time job at a local golf course and keep on riding his motorcycle in retirement.
Stan Ciurczak: Good afternoon, Rich. Thank you for allowing me to interview you for Inside the Fence.
Rich Johnson: You are very welcome, Stan.
Stan Ciurczak: How did you get started in your career here?
Rich Johnson: I worked for Lockheed Aircraft Services over at the FAA Hangar for 5 years. I saw a job opening out here and I put in for it and, somewhat surprisingly, I got it.
Stan Ciurczak: When did you work for Lockheed?
Rich Johnson: 1954-1964.
Stan Ciurczak: Was that for the National Aviation Facilities Experimental Center (NAFEC)?
Rich Johnson: Yes, from 1958-1964 we did work for NAFEC. Prior to that, from about 1954-1956, Lockheed did work for Atlantic City Airport .
Stan Ciurczak: When did you become a Federal employee?
Rich Johnson: I became a Federal employee in 1964.
Stan Ciurczak: As we speak, I’m looking out your window and I can see quite a few birds.
Rich Johnson: Yes they are feasting out there. Stand up and take a look. I cleared off a space from the snow to lay down some bird feed. Of course the blue jays are missing now, the black birds and so forth, but there are others that come around this time of year. I haven’t seen the turkeys lately. Some time ago, the second time I saw them; they were running at high speed down the edge of the wood line towards the back. Lately they have been around very little. I don’t understand why but this happened once before. They were gone for about a week and then they came back but that was during hunting season, I think. I was concerned that they may have become a turkey dinner.
Stan Ciurczak: Tell me what you do here in Building 203.
Rich Johnson: Building 203 on the R&D side of the Tech Center is considered to be a small materials test building. We test large sections of aircraft up in Building 275 and try to determine survivable limits, if you will, of new materials. We then develop a test method that industry can use to meet the requirements that we feel are necessary. There will be rules developed off those big tests to improve the materials. I don’t think you will ever make materials that are absolutely fire proof, but they can be highly fire resistant. Then we try and assist the industry in a test method that will prove that they have achieved that standard. A very interesting part of my tour here has been the travel I did to look at equipment all over the country and the world.
Stan Ciurczak: Have you traveled a lot in your job?
Rich Johnson: Yes, quite a bit. Larry Fitzgerald and myself went to several places. Our purpose was to train the Aircraft Certification Officials or ACO’s, as we call them, and make it easier for them to do their job because, in my opinion, they were spread kind of thin. They work quite a bit and check the work standards against the FAA’s regulations on fire resistant materials. The equipment is somewhat complicated and we have to be assured that they are up-to-date on it, and that meant traveling. We have another way of doing things now. About once a year we invited them here for a training class for about 4 days. It could be a new hire, a transferred person or someone who just wants to be updated.
Stan Ciurczak: What is your position and what kind of work do you do?
Rich Johnson: As the facility manager, my job basically is to operate the equipment, keep it up to standards and stay abreast of all the standards. I also try and watch after the building we work in.
Stan Ciurczak: Whom do you report to?
Rich Johnson: Gus Sarkos has been the chief of aircraft fire safety for a number of years. He is a real nice guy and we have a good working rapport.
Stan Ciurczak:Ginger Cairnes tells me that you have a background in acting and directing, too. Can you tell me about that?
Rich Johnson: Yes, I remember Ginger from the many years when she was in the Showmakers. One show in Atlantic City , called Flight Spirit, comes to mind. It was not at a casino but in the Viking Theater at Haddon Hall, which is on the 13 th floor of what is now the Resorts Casino and Hotel. That theater has a great history. It is a beautiful theater that seats about 200. I worked in there with the Showmakers for about 10 years, about three shows a year. There have been rumors in recent years about them tearing it down and doing something to benefit their business, however, the historical background prompted some possible delaying tactics or whatever. It is just beautiful inside. The workmanship inside is very interesting. The names of many famous composers are around the top edge. It is a small stage but functional. There is a very limited backstage, which is difficult to work with, but nonetheless we thought it was like a home. The dressing rooms are downstairs, and when a show required a quick wardrobe change you really had to move. It was very interesting and I enjoyed every bit of it.
Stan Ciurczak: How did you get involved with theatre?
Rich Johnson: Helen Beckert, a lady who formerly was Miss NAFEC, got me involved. Helen Vaspolli is her married name now. She is a charming lady I met when I was visiting my sister and brother-in-law. She came across the street to sell tickets to a show they were doing in Hammonton depicting the 100 th Anniversary of that town. I happened to be there and indicated I had an interest in theater. That was it; I was hooked! Ever since then I have been with the group.
Stan Ciurczak: Are you still involved?
Rich Johnson: A little bit. The last show I did was a couple years ago, “To Kill a Mockingbird.” I played the Judge part.
Stan Ciurczak: Oh, you act as well; you’re not just a stagehand?
Rich Johnson: I did every phase of the theater. From excellent tooling to Ruthina Rockelman, who is a former, Hollywood ballet and she did movies and she retired from the professional theater to get married. Being in the theater, of course, she got into this show business and she taught me everything! I was so attached to her and I learned everything I did. So in a period of time, I probably did about every phase of show business. I directed, played several lead roles including Gypsy and many other parts. One of my favorites that Helen directed was “Mr. Roberts.” I played the captain, which in the movie was done by James Cagney. Cagney fascinates me and I was able to apparently pull off the exit and everything. “All right Mr., let’s have this out, right here and now.” I really enjoyed it. I also played the judge in “A Few Good Men” and one of the Russian’s in “Silk Stockings.” In “Born Yesterday” I played the lead and had a wonderful time with that. Helen played opposite me; she is a terrific actress. So, I’ve had a wonderful career in the field. It is so different than test work that focuses on safety and seriousness. The theater is fun; it was a nice contrast.
Stan Ciurczak: I see several different military pictures behind you. Do you have a military background?
Rich Johnson: I spent 5 years in the Navy full-time and 15 years in the Army Reserve. At one time I was in charge of the motor pool in the local reserve center down in Northfield . Apparently because of the troops’ appreciation, they gave me a plaque of appreciation. Some of the other soldiers there said it was the first time they had seen them give that type of a plaque to someone. I tried to follow that well- known factor of service, when you become in charge of something and you have to tell someone else to do something, you better know how to do it yourself. I think they appreciated it. They came up with the photo and the plaque and everything and had it made.
Stan Ciurczak: You were an Aviation Mechanic for Lockheed?
Rich Johnson: I’ve been a mechanic all my life. I worked in an aircraft engine overhaul factory – Airwork – for 5 years before coming here; and that is what I did in the Navy. I was an aircraft mechanic. Originally, I think all my aircraft experience had something to do with me getting the job out here.
Stan Ciurczak: What was the name of the outfit you worked with after the Navy?
Rich Johnson: Airwork Corporation in Millville . That was all reciprocating engines that they were overhauling. Jets were just starting to come on the market, and by the time I left they were starting to take in jets, too.
Stan Ciurczak: Were you in the Navy here at Pomona ?
Rich Johnson: I was up in Newfoundland and got transferred down here right after the Korean War started. I was assigned to Squadron BC33.
Stan: You were way up in Newfoundland ?
Rich Johnson : Yes, I was with a complete aircraft service squadron where we handled maintenance work for aircraft that either was up there on patrol or actual Navy-type aircraft that would land there to pick up passengers and drop them off or whatever. If they had any problems, we took care of them – refueling, etc. – service work.
Stan Ciurczak: When did you transfer to the Naval Air Station Atlantic City?
Rich Johnson: July 1950. The Korean War started, I think, in June 1950.
Stan Ciurczak: Do you happen to have any old photos from your Navy days?
Rich Johnson: I’m sure I do.
Stan Ciurczak: Why do you think that NAFEC was set up here after the Navy base closed?
Rich Johnson: The potential for a fog was good. Another feature was that we were directly in line with the East coast of high-density traffic. As you know, we have a great expertise here in Air Traffic Control and a great opportunity there. I understand that Florida was considered as a potential site for NAFEC, primarily for the electricity work that was being done in lightning strikes. So that is why they wanted to go there but this place had more features and it was an excellent decision.
Stan Ciurczak: Were you born and raised in this area?
Rich Johnson: No, I was born and raised in Quincy , MA . I left there when I was 17 and that was it. I go back there once in awhile. I have one sister left up there but she is in a nursing home for rehab and is 87 years old. Soon I’ll be 75 myself.
Stan Ciurczak: Good for you!
Rich Johnson: I really don’t have a desire to retire.
Stan Ciurczak: I don’t blame you.
Rich Johnson: I had set a date for the beginning of June 2006, but as the date gets closer, I get further away from it. In June 2006 I will have 42 years of Federal service without counting my 5 years in the military, which would give me 47 years.
Stan Ciurczak: Tell me about that photo on your desk of your daughter.
Rich Johnson: My daughter is Lisa Johnson . She used to be an anchor for local TV station NBC Channel 40. The photo you’re looking at shows Lisa sitting in the middle of the car there with a couple of the boys who also were at Channel 40.
Stan Ciurczak: Of course. Where is she now?
Rich Johnson: My daughter Lisa is now in Las Vegas . She went out there to take the anchor job with Channel 8 out there, and she got an offer from the company that owns the Venetian Casino that she could not refuse. She is the Director of Public Relations there and is doing very well.
Stan Ciurczak: Who is in this photo of a Harley-Davidson?
Rich Johnson: This picture goes back to 1961 and I’m sitting on the end there on my Harley-Davidson. I’ve been riding for more than 50 years and I still ride. I have a Honda right now that I sometimes bring it to work. My current bike is close to 900 lbs.
Stan Ciurczak: How far do you drive?
Rich Johnson: I take trips and I go up to Lake George every year. I’ve been up there six or seven times and also have been to Daytona , Florida . I belong to a club called The Retreads. Every Sunday morning we have breakfast someplace different and go on trips after that. We might go to the Pocono’s, to Maryland or somewhere in Pennsylvania . I also have a commercial pilot’s license. I was able to fly some of the little aircraft at the Tech Center in what they called the little guy’s projects, which were designed to evaluate new pieces of equipment. I always had a check pilot ride with me. It was very interesting. I enjoyed the work, especially since it was free – in fact I got paid, too!
Stan Ciurczak: What were those projects all about?
Rich Johnson: They were the little guy’s projects in comparison with, say, the airline pilots. These are people who do not have an instrument rating and they want to see how they can get some device to get them to turn around if they ran into bad weather while in the flight. In other words, to be capable to make a 180-degree turn while you can’t see where you are going and have to rely on the instruments. That was part of it. There were other things too, such as collision-avoidance type work. That was all very interesting. That’s another nice thing about Gus Sarkos; he let me do that. It might take a couple hours or a day here or there.
A large part of our work involves accident investigation. We find out why an aircraft crashed, what can we do to make the fatalities less and we have developed some terrific, terrific programs that have saved lives and that is a great feeling. One of the things I don’t care for is the fact that no one in the surrounding area seems to know what we do here. The story that you are planning to write could help, if you would talk to Gus Sarkos and get some information that would enlighten local people about this place. I think this place is so important, and that is another reason why I don’t want to retire. It is very interesting work.
Stan Ciurczak: What year was this again?
Rich Johnson : Around 1960 or 1961. Because I went with them in 1959-64.
Stan Ciurczak: Should we go ahead and put the date on the back here?
Rich Johnson : Yes, around 1961.
Stan Ciurczak : This was about 3 years before you became a Fed.
Rich Johnson: Yes
Stan Ciurczak: I will return them all. All I have to do is scan it.
Rich Johnson : That might stir some memories of Lockheed Aircraft Services, but you can’t quite see it. It was called Lassie; Lockheed Aircraft Services, Inc. or something like that. I worked on a variety of aircraft; they had many different aircraft – not like it is today. Today they have several aircraft but I think we had more. We had Convair's, DC4, DC6, DC7, F9, F-Fighter, Beechcraft; I can’t remember all of it. Bill Coward who was a commander here at one time, he used to jump in that thing and he would never go to the runway. He would get off the ramp and go to the taxi way and go. He would say, this is my plane and I go where I want. I don’t think he said that, but it would seem that way. He was a very nice guy. I remember working on a ship one time on a Sunday, and we were doing a check on an Air Commando, that was another aircraft we had. Sunday afternoon he came in to see if we would have it done, because he had to go to Washington the next day. That was the attitude. You’d come in; you wouldn’t pick up the phone and call. You would come in.
Stan Ciurczak : I get the impression that there was a lot of that hands-on kind of stuff, back when. I read that when they did the 20 th anniversary of this place that the Base Commander would go from building to building checking on project work.
Rich Johnson: Well, this guy wasn’t a commander, but a chief scientist – he was a German fellow. However, I happened to be in a lounge one night and he was there and I sat next to him and we got to talking, and I told him that I wish he would come out and see our place and see what we are doing out there. He was kind of stunned and he said, well, I know that is where all the work is because all the reports are coming from out there and not here.
Stan Ciurczak : Was he chief scientist in Washington or here?
Rich Johnson: Here – he was physically here. He was one of the people we got from Germany after the war. He was a rocket scientist. He was a very intelligent person. I remember taking a PR to him one time, $2.50 for some stovepipe - we were making pipes out here, and he was disgusted. He said: Why am I signing something like this? Why should it go that high up the ladder? And I agreed with him but the concept at that time must have been that way. Maybe the purse strings were being tightened at that point. That’s how it was.
Stan Ciurczak: Tell me about the Supersonic Transport Jet Aircraft (SST).
Rich Johnson: On the SST we had the prototype that was being done out in California and when they lost the contract to the people who made the SST in England and France over there, they sold us the fuselage section. We set it up out in the field out here, in the pit, and we had our own fire and the firemen failed to follow proper procedures and the fuselage cracked. Before they opened the door, there was an explosion – and this was perhaps the greatest thing we learned – but there was an explosion inside and there was nothing in there but a few chairs, and a rug but they used an RTV sealer on it, a silicone base type, and it would turn to a fine dust. The same thing happened there and when this metal got hot it would ignite and it exploded inside. It was inconceivable; knocking cameras over and everything, because the cameras they put in there, we assured them that the temperature probably would not reach over 400 degrees. Well, it went a little higher than that and we lost the film. They sent the film to Eastman Kodak and they couldn’t even retrieve it. That was the sad part of the whole thing, but the one basic thing that the chief engineer on that – he was French and he immediately got in touch with the French and told them not to use RTV for a sealer. I believe they did switch and I think that was one of the greatest benefits out of that project. So we did a lot of testing in-house here, small-scale, and practically duplicated the non-explosions, how it degraded under the heat and turned into what was like a white fog.
Stan Ciurczak: Thanks, Rich. It has been a pleasure speaking with you about your distinguished career in the Government. Best good wishes to you in retirement!
|
